Discussion On Iand Mind

A discussion. I and Mind relationships

Original statement: "I have made up my mind."

Summary

"I" and "my mind" are not separate entities, one of which controls the other, so taken literally, the statement doesn't really make sense. What is meant is merely "I have an opinion - which I don't expect to change". The original wording is used to avoid dealing with the fact that any opinion will almost certainly be changed if one sees the information and/or reasoning on which it is based has significantly changed or was incorrect.

Counterpoint

In eastern traditions of enlightenment, the mind is not identical to the self; that perception is considered an illusion, and the purpose of meditation is to develop a perception of the difference between the true self and the mind. In these traditions it is pointless to believe or not believe this, because those are activities of the mind. The point is to allow the true self to directly perceive itself.

There is no useful distinction in this context between 'I' and 'my mind'. You did some thinking and formed an opinion. We all do that, and we can all change our opinions - they're very rarely final - so none of us will come any closer to 'deciding the matter' than merely forming an opinion.

I find it useful to distinguish between the two, and it is more than just an opinion, it is a decision and a way of living, a discipline and a way of dealing with life issues and other people. It is not just a philosophy or mental state.

I wasn't referring to 'matter' (over mind), but to your apparent point as to where the discussion you mentioned can lead. It can lead only to opinions being formed (or modified) in one's mind. There isn't a separate 'I' to tell the mind what to decide or vice versa. A view that's 'decided' is simply one that is currently held particularly strongly (hence it may affect your whole lifestyle). It's not immutable.

[Note: the reference to "matter" above relates to a specific use of that word which has disappeared during editing - maybe it was just a typo.]

Your concepts seem clear enough to you, and my concepts seem clear enough to me. They are different and not likely to change. My thinking and behaviour is based on a belief I hold. I try to be consistent to that belief. This is a result of a decision I made years ago. The world and all that surrounds me now has changed drastically, but the decision has not changed. I live with a certainty and a peace of mind as a result of that decision. My lifestyle most certainly is affected by that decision.

I'm not making a personal point. The generality is that any opinions are changed just as soon as the relevant underlying information or reasoning is seen to have changed significantly or to be mistaken. It would be very hard not to change a belief in such circumstances. In relation to this, 'I' and 'my mind' are not separable, so 'I have made up my mind' is not literally valid.

I am making a personal point. I is a personal pronoun, mind is a noun. Mind is part of I, Hand is part of I, Big toe is part of I, Eye is part of I. I is not just mind and mental activity.

Don't be silly. Many would say that 'I' is an aspect of 'mind', but the relevance of 'I' in the context relates to the mental activity - the broader meaning isn't germane to the point made.

Don't be silly. ...

Look closely. He's not being silly. The mind is machinery. "I" is what animates the machinery. "I" has opinions. "I" has a mind. Consciousness is not an "aspect" of the machinery of the mind. Consciousness is what "I" does.

Believe what you will. GravityWorks.